This is my response to my friend Amy's post {which you should read} about her frustration over a recent trip to the Dr. for her two year old's immunizations. { I've added a couple of things to my original comment.} I feel so strongly about this, that I had to post it here.
I'm all for immunizing my children, but I do not understand the need to constantly be adding new "required" vaccines. Please. My 8 year old didn't have these extra shots and she's just fine. But now, they act like my 5 year old is going to die if he doesn't have them? Give. me. a. break.
Having Jake has given me a extra long peek at the medical world, and the more I see, the more I dislike it.
I am SO tired of the medical profession, schools, government, etc. telling us how to live. Yes, there are major advantages to modern medicine, but it is not the be all, end all to a healthy life.
What about eating healthy? What about lifestyle? I believe that if we would re-focus {myself included} on these things, we would not have to worry about half of the illnesses and chronic disease that we face today. It would not even be an issue. A great reference is The Word of Wisdom.
I just hate the push for the constant medication of our children. I have never, ever liked medicine. Even as a child, I hated the way that it made me feel when I took it. I feel like "modern medicine" too many times seems to go for a band-aid approach to health. That is, it seems to me that they only mask the symptoms of health problems, and don't look for the root of the problem.
I also hate that they act like we as patients have no right to question their "authority" or to look for other alternatives. {I am speaking from personal experience on this one} And if we do, then we are viewed as weird or as being irresponsible with our health or our children's health. I feel like immunizations are becoming the same way and I don't like it.
I totally agree with you that we need to get some of those little bugs. As much as I want to keep my children healthy and happy, I can't protect them from every little germ or sickness out there. I want to build up their immune systems so that they can fight off those germs and diseases.
A loving Heavenly Father created our bodies. They are miracles! I firmly believe that if we treat our bodies correctly, then they will be more able to respond and fight off those harmful sicknesses. This amazing woman is a perfect example to me of this theory. Because of the way that she respected her body, and treated it before the accident, she is still here and fighting! What an inspiration she is to me! Slowly, but surely I want to be this way.
I could be wrong, but giving extra shots just doesn't seem like the answer to me.
Whew! When I rant, I REALLY rant!
Agree or disagree?
Let's respectfully discuss.
Thursday, October 09, 2008
My rant.
Posted by tharker at 11:57 PM
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27 Thoughts:
I agree with you on the word of wisdom that it will keep our bodies clean and healthly. The only problem is that the rest of the world is not. Most people live for the moment and not for purpose of life.
I do hate that they keep adding things to the list but I keep letting them poke my sweey little children because I don't want them to catch another sweet childs sick.
I agree and disagree. I think you are right about not needing to push medicine at every problem. Eating right and exercising are so important to good health but it is such a change of habits that most people (I include myself here) don't follow these tenets close enough. When it comes to immunizations, I look at it this way. The new ones that they have come up with in the last few years are certainly not going to make or break a person. However, if they had, had shots for meningitis when my children were young I would have been more than happy to have them get the shot. I feel that these are some of the best medical discoveries today. I would much rather prevent childhood diseases than try to cope with them. There are so many devastating illnesse that have been wiped out due to immunization. I also think that new medical discoveries are mostly inspired through heavenly inspiration for the good of us all, so I feel that used properly they are a real blessing.
And please don't hate me for this Tiffani, but I think that this new backlash against modern advances in medicine is somewhat pushed by the environmentalists. They won't be happy until our population is cut in half and the ones left alive are living a pre industrialization kind of life.
I totally feel you on the whole "how dare you question the doctors authority" thing. Like I can't make up my own mind for MY own child. The first pediatrition I went to with Jacob made me feel like an incompetent idiot. I was a new mother and I did not not to be made felt that way. Kevin said, "Switch doctors then." Sometimes I forget that I have the right to choose what I feel is right. Our current doctor is great but he ALWAYS lectures me on vaccines. I drives me nuts. He even lectured me on the new is it called PVC shot thta girls SHOULD get when they are like between 8 and 12?. I was like she's 5 dude!! But that's a whole different discussion I think:)
Thanks for posting this. I am glad I could help you rant!!
I certainly do not hate you for sharing your opinion Susan! I am glad to have this discussion. I am definitely not an environmentalist pushing an agenda, and I am for vaccinating my kids. Amy's point about the PVC vaccine is a great example to me of this problem. From what I've read, and I could be wrong, but this disease that the PVC vaccine is supposed to protect girls from could be prevented with abstinence. To me it's just another example of the medical community allowing people to not be responsible for their choices that would lead to sicknesses like PVC.
Anyway, I'm so glad that you are participating in this discussion Susan. I know you have years and years of knowledge and personal experience in this area with everything that you have been through with Shawn, and I very much value your opinion. Thank you for sharing it!!!
Baby Girl's last immunizations were at one year. You see, I have another reason to wonder about vaccinations... not long after my son got his 18 month immunizations, we started to notice loss of speech. It was gradual, so maybe it would have happened anyway, but I CAN'T rule out the possibility that vaccinations MAY have caused my sons autism. Maybe it didn't, but can I really take that risk on my other child? What if there is something in our genes? What if genetically we are predisposed for autism and something in our environment triggers it? What if that something is immunizations? Can I really put my youngest at risk? Sigh... on the other hand, I'm risking her health by not getting those immunizations. So hard to be a mom...
These are tough issues for us mothers to think about. We want to protect our children above and beyond anything else. It is quite alarming though, what I have read about the correlations between autism and immunizations and every time my kids would get them I would just pray everything would be alright. That being said, we definitely have to keep vaccinating our children, and doing the best we can with the inforamation we have to go on. The pharmacutical companies and other special interest groups have way too much influence on what goes on in the medical community and that scares me.
Did you know that your child could DIE from mumps or measles or yes even chicken pox?? What about Hepatitis? I want my kids immune from that. In the world we live in that is the way to go.
I know that doctors aren't perfect, they are only human, but as a conscious mother I think immunizations are a way that I can do something to keep my kids healthy!
I couldn't do anything to save Austin, but you better believe my next baby will get all the shots he needs for his safety and for my peace of mind.
I am in no way saying that immunizing is wrong. My children are immunized. But, why does my 5 year old really need TWO chicken pox vaccines when my 8 year old only needed ONE just 3 years ago?
Yes, I want to keep my children healthy, but I also think that we can't protect them from everything. We do the best we can.
I agree with most all of you on this issue. Some of you may know our family's heart is within the alternative medical field. I believe modern medicine does have its place, sometimes. My story sounds quite a lot like Melissa's actually.
There is nothing that says we have to have the same vaccine schedule as they propose. You can pick and choose vaccines. You don't have or need to get 5 in one visit. There are alternatives.
Tiff, you are quite right in my opinion, WHY does Jake need something more than what Hannah had? And if I had to do it all over again, I'm not sure which side of the fence I'd be? I definitely would make a slower schedule, and I would have my child's titers tested (simple blood test to see if the vaccine is still present) before giving any repeated doses.
All in all, it is OUR choice, not the Dr. not the money hungry FDA, OURS! We have to live with the decisions we make and we should be able to make them without feeling guilty.
I guess just to be clear- my children have had SOME of the vaccines. We no longer opt for vaccines, On the rare occasion we need to see a Dr.
In fact, my children haven't been to a MD for over a year and a half. We seem to be doing quite well.
oh how i love this topic. it's so controversial that it's hard to open up the box sometimes. i'm glad that you did.
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when i learned that they wanted to send my newborn home full of shots i kindly declined...and got to work. after much research we decided to go with a delayed schedule. just started his shots on his second birthday. we worked with a naturopath who is much more open to respecting my thoughts as his parent. one shot at a time. rather than 3 or 4 {had we followed the regular schedule his little body would have had 21 shots by now!}this way we can monitor how he reacts to each shot specifically. some i feel are completely unnecessary and have not been around long enough to even know if they are healthy or safe. why not be aware and informed?... empowered.
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don't even get me started on childbirth! i remember you saying once on your blog how much you loved giving birth. those very words of yours have been on my mind as i prepare to birth this babe. thank you for sharing your inner voice on this bloggy of yours.
love, lindsay
Tiffany and Lindsay, I had no idea that you could choose to lengthen out the shot schedule! That is great news to me. But again it frustrates me because do you ever hear your conventional Dr. telling you this information? No.
To me, it's all about options, and we as the parents need to feel empowered to make those choices. I don't feel like conventional medicine even gives us those options. I guess this is my biggest frustration here.
Lindsay, I would love to talk birthing with you sometimes. It is so near to my heart. There is nothing that I have done in my life that has left me feeling so strong and empowered as when I gave birth to my 3 children. 2 vaginal, one C-section. Ahh, just thinking about makes me feel so happy!
I have chosen just to wait on certain vaccines. I never let my kids get the MMR until after one year, and I'm also choosing to wait on the chicken pox booster. Recently a doctor told me that all the obsessions with anti-bacterial everything is only making the problem of diseases worst. We are getting stronger strains of everything that are more resistant to treatment. Last year I had strep throat three times, and realized the antibiotics (and I did the entire course as directed) were only knocking it down, and never getting rid of it. Finally I had to wean Josie so I could get a drug that actually worked.
I'm no doctor, but what your doctor says makes perfect sense to me Michelle.
Also, I need to correct a comment that I made earlier. In talking about a certain vaccine, I referred to it as the PVC vaccine. If I'm not mistaken, PVC is plastic pipe used for plumbing. Hahhaa!!!
What I meant to say was the HPV vaccine. (Human Papiloma Virus).
I told you I was bad at this medical stuff:) LOL. Ha ha, sorry about the whole PVC thing, my bad, but maybe there will be a PVC vaccine soon:)!! HA HA
Hmm, controversial post! So here is my two bits.
I don't think that 'conventional' doctors are the bad guys. Most doctors are concerned with the well-being and health of your children (and not the appeasement of pharmaceutical companies!). They are basing their recommendations from what they have collectively learned, guidelines that have a scientific foundation (such as vaccination schedules) science, and what has generally been proven to be helpful and effective(again through science and time). The reason that your doctor wants Jake to have an extra shot that Hannah did not have, is most likely due to scientific advancements and knowledge of a better way to vaccinate that may have happened over the last couple of years. If you used the mentality that, well my parents didn't get those vaccines when they were little and they are fine, why do my kids need them, then there would still be a lot of communicable diseases out there that would be a constant crippling or deadly threat.
As for the link between autism and vaccinations, there have been a lot, A LOT Of scientific studies on this and there is overwhelming evidence that suggests there is NO cause and effect relationship between the two. There is no evidence that spreading out the vaccination shots would have any effect on autism, either. The complaint that the doctor didn't give you any options is because the one he presented you with was proven to be the safest one. Not vaccinating your children is a much greater risk. So probably not an option a doctor would recommend. Spreading out the shots poses a risk in that the schedule for vaccination has a great deal to do with obtaining the vaccination before the ages that a child is most susceptible to contracting the illnesses, and delaying it would mean your are putting your childs health at risk (again not an option a doctor would likely suggest).
I agree with your point that we should be doing what we can to prevent illness and disease through exercise and observing the word of wisdom- and this is also one of the main points that drs and the health profession as a whole advocate- exercise and eat healthy. But even with a healthy body, we can't expect never to contract illness and diseases. Modern science and medicine help us, and a lot of times, it saves our lives in situations where previous generations would have died. It should also be remembered, that our modern field of medicine, though imperfect, is the reason the quality of life and the average life expectancy have greately increased over the last century. Don't dismiss that vast amount of knowledge, because we decide to lean on our own understanding of the field of medicine.
I am not advocating that we as parents have to treat the drs opinion as law, but I don't believe in acting like we know more than the drs. We don't. I believe in parent's intuition, I believe in second opinions. I believe in asking questions when we encounter things we don't understand or have concerns about. It is our right and our duty as a parent. Most doctors will respect your right.
Wow, sorry about the book I wrote!I feel like I should include a table of contents, epilogue, and appendix!! I have pretty strong opinions on this matter, as I can see most other people do too. It's good to discuss.
It is good to discuss, and it has been very fun and informative for me to listen to everyone else's opinions here. It's been good for me.
No I don't think that Dr.s themselves are the bad guys. I think a lot of the problem stems from insurance companies and drug companies pushing their own agendas to make more money and that infuriates me. I agree that most Dr.s went into their line of work with the desire to help others. And I believe that most Dr.s still practice with this mentality. I do feel sorry for them because I think that in so many cases their hands are tied. They have the constant threat of malpractice, and then insurance and drug companies pushing their own agendas.
Thank you for the book Brooke. You can go ahead and email me that glossary and index at your nearest convenience ;)
I agree totally on the band-aid approach. I hate that so many medical professionals just want to give you a quick fix, rather than finding out where the problem originated. I haven't really seen a lot of other problems, because my interactions have been relatively few, but I am sure as I have little ones I will feel the same way. Way to be passionate Tiff!
Oh, I forgot to mention, I totally agree with your statement that if we all took a little better care of ourselves there would be a lot fewer problems to deal with. The Word of Wisdom is truly inspired. And I think we could all be a little better about following it's guidelines, myself included. Thanks for the reminder!
Sorry, I'm a little fired up about this :)
I completely agree with the W of W. I completely agree there is a place for medicine. I completely agree that SOME vaccines are a good thing. I completely agree that there are SOME good Dr.s out there. But lets face it, some go into it for the $. Most don't think about you or I after they have left the room. Yes, their hands might be tied. BUT, I bet if you look into how many of the employees of the FDA have their children or grandchildren vaccinated, you won't find many. I actually got a Dr. in my ward to admit that he has NEVER cured anyone. Only masked their symptoms. Oh, and Dr's get paid for each and every vaccine and prescription they give. Just sayin'.
Wow, you are fired up Tiffany!
I have thoroughly enjoyed this conversation today. Thank you all for participating and respecting each others views.
This was a great read and the comments fab. Loved it. I love the word of wisdom. I did the delay thing on my last 2 children for the immunization shots.
I am prone to wishng they never had to have them. I also had all my children naturally. No medication at all. I was scared of it more than the pain. And my first one was over 10pds. Ouch. But I loved giving birth too. Empowering and a miracle. But I don't want to do it again. I just learned that a friend of ours who is 50 is pregnant. No thank you.
Loved your message today :) You are a doll.
Wow, why to stir up some controversy. If you want to read what the church has to say on immunizations, go to http://providentliving.org/content/list/0,11664,2408-1,00.html. They have an entire section dedicated to Disease Prevention.
Thanks for the link Shells!
That should have said "way to stir up some controversy" not "why to . . ."
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